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Subject: [Intlwiki-l] Re: [Wikipedia-l] Re: No voting? Then what? - msg#00332List: science.linguistics.wikipedia.internationalwrote: > On Sun, Oct 27, 2002 at 07:45:39AM -0800, Anthere > wrote: > > Ah no. Consensus is not when everybody is *happy*. > A > > decision is taken only when everybody agree for > the > > decision to be taken, which is very slightly > > different. > Some serious problems with consensus that I'm sure > you're > aware of but bear mentioning anyway: > > * It only works well when the population has quite > similar views and > attitudes, Absolutely. The fr.wiki is democratically voting. > * It slows everything down, Agree. We have time in this case > * It is biased in favour of whatever the status quo > is, Very true. Notice that in the current case, nobody (I think) voted for option 1) keep www.wikipedia.org just as it is. So this point is not valid in the current case. > * It gives a heavily disproportionate advantage to > those willing or able > to shout longer and louder. Hum, yes. However, right now, it doesnot seem obvious to me that those still shouting, or shouting very loudly are having a clear advantage over the others. Or, am I wrong ? Which are the other drawbacks ? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ Thread at a glance:
Previous Message by Date: click to view message preview[Intlwiki-l] Re: [Wikipedia-l] Wikipedia software upgrade status--- Pierre Abbat <phma-ce9h4FcxEoVIf6P1QZMOBw@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > On Saturday 26 October 2002 18:36, Brion VIBBER > wrote: > > Just a reminder... > > > > The French localization is ready to go, I can do a > final upgrade to the > > new server and software whenever is convenient. > (Anthere, Aoineko, vous > > êtes prêts ?) > > Moi aussi. Je serai content de voir les accents au > lieu des mots compressés > comme "Prfrences". > > phma moi aussi BTW, Sous Opéra les mots avec une majuscule accentuée dans la barre grise du haut sont remplacés par les mêmes avec une miniscule accentuée. Par exemple WIKIPéDIA ou SPéCIALES Peux t on y faire quelque chose ??? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ Next Message by Date: click to view message preview[Intlwiki-l] Re: [Wikipedia-l] No voting? Then what?I agree with everything you said but > If everybody on the list agrees except for TC, then > that is consensus. It seems to me that as long as somebody *strongly* (strongly meaning not "mumble mumble, I am not very happy with this...", but heavy unhappiness), there is no consensus. For if somebody disagrees absolutely with a decision, he/she might feel like his/her only option is to leave. And if he/she leaves, it's a loss, and it's not good (of course, I don't mean here that tc would leave :-), but others would) Besides, that would require to define a "level" over or under which the number of very unhappy people is acceptable in terms of consensual decision or not. How many people have been expressing their views here ? say 25. How would we decide 1 over 25 is an acceptable number to ratify a decision and say it is consensual ? Why would it not be 10 over 25 acceptable rather ? Or why not 12 ? (that would make the 49%) If you enter into a "number" process, that's voting. What do you think ? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ Previous Message by Thread: click to view message preview[Intlwiki-l] Re: [Wikipedia-l] Wikipedia software upgrade status--- Pierre Abbat <phma-ce9h4FcxEoVIf6P1QZMOBw@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > On Saturday 26 October 2002 18:36, Brion VIBBER > wrote: > > Just a reminder... > > > > The French localization is ready to go, I can do a > final upgrade to the > > new server and software whenever is convenient. > (Anthere, Aoineko, vous > > êtes prêts ?) > > Moi aussi. Je serai content de voir les accents au > lieu des mots compressés > comme "Prfrences". > > phma moi aussi BTW, Sous Opéra les mots avec une majuscule accentuée dans la barre grise du haut sont remplacés par les mêmes avec une miniscule accentuée. Par exemple WIKIPéDIA ou SPéCIALES Peux t on y faire quelque chose ??? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ Next Message by Thread: click to view message preview[Intlwiki-l] Re: [Wikipedia-l] No voting? Then what?I agree with everything you said but > If everybody on the list agrees except for TC, then > that is consensus. It seems to me that as long as somebody *strongly* (strongly meaning not "mumble mumble, I am not very happy with this...", but heavy unhappiness), there is no consensus. For if somebody disagrees absolutely with a decision, he/she might feel like his/her only option is to leave. And if he/she leaves, it's a loss, and it's not good (of course, I don't mean here that tc would leave :-), but others would) Besides, that would require to define a "level" over or under which the number of very unhappy people is acceptable in terms of consensual decision or not. How many people have been expressing their views here ? say 25. How would we decide 1 over 25 is an acceptable number to ratify a decision and say it is consensual ? Why would it not be 10 over 25 acceptable rather ? Or why not 12 ? (that would make the 49%) If you enter into a "number" process, that's voting. What do you think ? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ Loading Comments...
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