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Today's topics:

* Dow in Pune!, We must resist! - 4 messages, 3 authors
 
http://groups.google.com/group/BM_discussion/browse_thread/thread/a5f4fe6a901a1511?hl=en

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Dow in Pune!, We must resist!
http://groups.google.com/group/BM_discussion/browse_thread/thread/a5f4fe6a901a1511?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 22 2007 4:37 am 
From: Anil  


i didn't understand why we must resist....

if Union Carbide was responsible for the Bhopal gas massacre in 1994, why
are we poking our finger at DOW which bought it only in 2001..

and I feel DOW's stand that they cannot take up responsibility for the
massacre in 1994 is fair enough.. If the money paid by Union Carbide did not
reach the families, then its a problem with the Union Carbide system and our
own distribution system.. if any thing we need to point out the exact flaws
that happened then, and see to it that it does not repeat again..

and between paying £10.5 million for cleaning up or £500 million as
investment.. I would choose latter.. £10.5 million for cleaning up would
probably entirely go into politicians' bank accounts.. and if they were
entirely used for cleaning up I don't think it would do much of good to the
nation on the larger scale.. whereas £500 million in investment.. that would
create many employment opportunities..

and for this £500 million by DOW, I think our govt. can spend £10.5 million
in the cleaning.. and even more, why hasn't the government spent those £10.5
million in cleaning all these 13 yrs.. they could have still forced DOW to
pay the govt... then atlesast people wouldn't have been suffering for these
13 yrs as well...

this is what I think is the prob.. our govt. took no action so far.. they
just blamed it on Union Carbide and now DOW.. and no organisation till now
put any pressure on the govt.. even if they did, they didn't put sufficient
pressure.. even now the articles like the one just posted on the group,
though don't mean say anything directly still give subtle implications..
like in this case the govt. getting sold for a £500 million investment in
India.. whats the govt. going to get out of it?? whats any politician going
to get if DOW did indeed invest £500 million in India for their private
motives, but ended up doing some good to the unemployed Indians..

In light of my arguements above, I ask you all now..
"it goes without saying, that WE MUST RESIST." --- Really?? How and Why??

Anil
A global Indian


On Nov 22, 2007 12:12 PM, Abhijit K 
<abhijit13-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> Hi all,
> As you must be knowing,  DOW CHEMICALS, the parent company of UNION
> CARBIDE (the company responsible for Bhopal gas massacre) is back in
> India... and they are going to setup a plant near pune.
>
> it goes without saying, that WE MUST RESIST.  We are definitely going to
> resist it here in Pune, through all possible means, and we have started
> planning for the same.
>
> I appeal to all BM-ites, anywhere, to protest in whatever forms possible.
>
> - abhijit
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Shalini Sharma 
> <shalini-9geRo0GdX4lFkAh08a1FFZcPDiHTxzko@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Date: Nov 22, 2007 11:42 AM
> Subject: [YSC] India's betryal of Bhopal-Scotsman
> To: 
> sfbupdates.india-3+4lAyCyj6DezusRgbny/IAey6BUdJ7nQH7oEaQurus@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>
>   * http://news.scotsman.com/international.cfm?id=1835382007 * *India's
> betrayal of Bhopal*
>
> PAMELA TIMMS AND PRABAL KR DAS IN DEHLI
>
> CAMPAIGNERS last night accused the Indian government of betrayal as it
> prepared to welcome the company behind the Bhopal chemical disaster back to
> the country.
>
> In the early hours of 3 December, 1984, 5,000 people died when a leak at
> Union Carbide's pesticide plant caused a 40-tonne cloud of toxic gas to
> descend on the city. It is claimed 20,000 others have since died as a result
> of continuing pollution from the plant.
>
> Activists say there is a new death every day linked to the disaster and
> that, for 23 years, Union Carbide and its parent company, Dow Chemical, have
> failed to take responsibility for cleaning up.
>
> In 2004, the Indian government brought a court case, demanding Dow pay
> £10.5 million to clean up the 8,000 tonnes of toxic waste still in the
> factory and surrounding area.
>
> But victims' groups have obtained documents from the office of the prime
> minister, Manmohan Singh, which they claim show that senior ministers are
> advocating an out-of-court settlement with Dow that would allow the company
> to walk away from its responsibilities in Bhopal
>
> in return for a proposed £500 million investment in India.
>
> The government has signed an agreement with Dow, allowing the firm to
> establish new research and development bases in Pune, Chennai and Mumbai.
>
> Dow has been waging a ferocious lobbying war against the victims' groups,
> recruiting some of India's most influential tycoons, including Ratan Tata,
> head of the Tata conglomerate, to lobby ministers on its behalf. Earlier
> this year, Mr Tata wrote to the government, proposing that a "remediation
> fund" be established to clean up the site, in order to relieve Dow of its
> liabilities and allow the company to invest in India.
>
> Rachna Dhingra, of the Bhopal Group for Information and Action, said: "In
> 23 years since the disaster in Bhopal, the government has learned nothing.
> For 23 years, they have betrayed the people of Bhopal. They are bowing to
> Dow in the interest of commercial investment in India."
>
> Mr Dhingra believes that Dow should not be allowed to do business in India
> until it cleans up the toxic waste in and around the factory, which,
>
> he says, has left local residents suffering from liver and kidney diseases
> and nervous system disorders.
>
> Studies show the rates of cancer and other diseases have risen
> dramatically in the area since the disaster.
>
> Mr Dhingra went on: "25,000 people in the Bhopal area continue to this day
> to drink contaminated water. They suffer all sorts of serious medical
> conditions, including respiratory diseases, cancer, blindness and babies
> born with congenital birth defects.
>
> "[Dow] have to pay compensation to the people who continue to live with
> the effects of the disaster. It's simple: no justice, no business."
>
> The victims' campaign was given a boost this year when Indra Sinha's novel
> Animal's People, which tells of a young man horribly maimed by the disaster,
> was shortlisted for the Booker prize. The Edinburgh-based author Meaghan
> Delahunt is also due to publish a novel set in Bhopal.
> *FIRM BELIEVES FINANCIAL RESPONSIBILITY FULFILLED*
>
> DOW Chemical has consistently maintained that it accepts no responsibility
> for the 1984 disaster. Dow purchased Union Carbide in 2001 for $10.3 billion
> in stock and debt.
>
> Dow has publicly stated several times that earlier compensation payments
> by Union Carbide to the families of those who died on the night have already
> fulfilled Dow's financial responsibility for the disaster. In reality very
> little of the money Union Carbide agreed to pay in the immediate aftermath
> of the disaster found its way to the victims' families.
>
> Union Carbide paid on average $500 to the families, but campaigners
> complain this amount barely covered the immediate costs to the relatives,
> like funerals.
>
> Campaigners see in Dow's return a government's willingness to forget the
> plight of its own people when tempted by the prospect of major investment.
> Speaking to The Scotsman, Greenpeace's executive director in India, Ananth
> Padmanabhan, said: "It is immoral, unethical and shameful that the
> government of India has favoured foreign direct investment over justice. It
> is shocking that the government is actually willing to scuttle existing
> legal cases to facilitate Dow's entry into India." He expressed his
> confidence that public opinion and the "indomitable will" of the Bhopal
> victims will succeed in making a difference.
> *People and the environment will face new threats*
>
> PRABUL KR DAS, Assam Tribune staff reporter on placement with The
> Scotsman, was a communications adviser for Greenpeace during its campaign
> for victims of Bhopal
>
> IN THE race to rapid economic gains, India could well be entering its most
> dangerous phase of environmental degradation and decay. Significant
> instances like the Bhopal gas disaster of 1984 make world headlines, but
> there are similar events in smaller scale happening every day across India;
> the more remote the place, the more dangerous the situation. Bhopal was the
> wake-up call for the Indian government, but it did precious little to put
> pressure on Union Carbide and later Dow Chemical to compensate the victims
> and to clean up the place.
>
> Years later, the government is now keen to invite Dow Chemical to operate
> in India. Among the journalists who have spent time with the victims of
> Bhopal, it appears to me as a travesty of justice. But such incidents of the
> government favouring industry and trade over human and environmental
> concerns are actually growing more common.
>
> In different parts of the country, the industrial juggernaut is making its
> presence felt more than ever. In the state of West Bengal, a place called
> Singur witnessed ugly incidents after land was requisitioned from farmers
> for a car factory. A large number of people lost their traditional means of
> livelihood. In my state of Assam, inside the famous Kaziranga National Park,
> which is also a world heritage site, the state government allowed a stone
> quarry to operate. It raised a huge hue and cry, and along with fellow
> scribes I produced reports featuring maps and co-ordinates. For a few days
> the machines stopped ... only to start again.
>
> After reporting from around India, I think the interests of human beings
> and the natural environment are deeply threatened. The smallest of elites
> have derived benefits while the vulnerable and the marginalised have
> remained voiceless.
>
> One might be compelled to call it the rape of the conscience or of common
> sense, depending how one looks at it.
>
>
>
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Believe it or not, you received this message because you've subscribed to
> the
> icjb-planning-3+4lAyCyj6DezusRgbny/IAey6BUdJ7nQH7oEaQurus@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx 
> mailing list. And also because
> you're totally cool.
>
> But, hey - we can't all be cool ALL the time. So if you'd like to be
> removed from the list, you can
> do so yourself. Simply send ANY message to
> icjb-planning-unsubscribe-3+4lAyCyj6DezusRgbny/IAey6BUdJ7nm7qdpzl9ie0@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>
> If you're curious about list information and functions (though I can't
> imagine who would be) you
> can read all about them (oh, joy!) at 
> http://lists.studentsforbhopal.org/lists/info/icjb-planning
> .
>
> Justice for Bhopal!
> www.studentsforbhopal.org
>
>
>
> --
> Abhijit Minakshi
> About my name: www.geocities.com/abhijit1303/aboutname.txt
> >
>
 



== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 22 2007 5:00 am 
From: "Abhijit K"  


Read here:  http://www.studentsforbhopal.org/

Answers to your questions in short (we can't debate in email dear brother,
however since you asked:)
* A company buys another company, so it buys all its liabilities. If Dow
does not own Union carbide's sins, then it is like saying that Since I've
taken a bath in Ganges, i should not be hanged for killing you.
* Dow is notorious, you'll find if you you do some internet search.
* Union carbide paid a pittance compared to its sins. It was cutting on the
protection measures to "cut-costs" (that is to retain its profits at the
cost of lives of millions) and thats why the Bhopal tragedy happened.
* There is an unofficial news that this plant in pune was denied permission
in US and europe.
* Politicians corruption, Dow's business are indepedent of each other.  They
might have got money to allow Dow a plant (because so many people are
protesting!)
* ...
- a.

On 11/22/07, Anil <anil.kuchibhatla-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
wrote:
>
> i didn't understand why we must resist....
>
> if Union Carbide was responsible for the Bhopal gas massacre in 1994, why
> are we poking our finger at DOW which bought it only in 2001..
>
> and I feel DOW's stand that they cannot take up responsibility for the
> massacre in 1994 is fair enough.. If the money paid by Union Carbide did not
> reach the families, then its a problem with the Union Carbide system and our
> own distribution system.. if any thing we need to point out the exact flaws
> that happened then, and see to it that it does not repeat again..
>
> and between paying £10.5 million for cleaning up or £500 million as
> investment.. I would choose latter.. £10.5 million for cleaning up would
> probably entirely go into politicians' bank accounts.. and if they were
> entirely used for cleaning up I don't think it would do much of good to the
> nation on the larger scale.. whereas £500 million in investment.. that
> would create many employment opportunities..
>
> and for this £500 million by DOW, I think our govt. can spend £10.5
> million in the cleaning.. and even more, why hasn't the government spent
> those £10.5 million in cleaning all these 13 yrs.. they could have still
> forced DOW to pay the govt... then atlesast people wouldn't have been
> suffering for these 13 yrs as well...
>
> this is what I think is the prob.. our govt. took no action so far.. they
> just blamed it on Union Carbide and now DOW.. and no organisation till now
> put any pressure on the govt.. even if they did, they didn't put sufficient
> pressure.. even now the articles like the one just posted on the group,
> though don't mean say anything directly still give subtle implications..
> like in this case the govt. getting sold for a £500 million investment in
> India.. whats the govt. going to get out of it?? whats any politician going
> to get if DOW did indeed invest £500 million in India for their private
> motives, but ended up doing some good to the unemployed Indians..
>
> In light of my arguements above, I ask you all now..
> "it goes without saying, that WE MUST RESIST." --- Really?? How and Why??
>
> Anil
> A global Indian
>
>
> On Nov 22, 2007 12:12 PM, Abhijit K < 
> abhijit13-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> > Hi all,
> > As you must be knowing,  DOW CHEMICALS, the parent company of UNION
> > CARBIDE (the company responsible for Bhopal gas massacre) is back in
> > India... and they are going to setup a plant near pune.
> >
> > it goes without saying, that WE MUST RESIST.  We are definitely going to
> > resist it here in Pune, through all possible means, and we have started
> > planning for the same.
> >
> > I appeal to all BM-ites, anywhere, to protest in whatever forms
> > possible.
> >
> > - abhijit
> >
> > ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> > From: Shalini Sharma 
> > <shalini-9geRo0GdX4lFkAh08a1FFZcPDiHTxzko@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > Date: Nov 22, 2007 11:42 AM
> > Subject: [YSC] India's betryal of Bhopal-Scotsman
> > To: 
> > sfbupdates.india-3+4lAyCyj6DezusRgbny/IAey6BUdJ7nQH7oEaQurus@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >
> >   * http://news.scotsman.com/international.cfm?id=1835382007 * *India's
> > betrayal of Bhopal*
> >
> > PAMELA TIMMS AND PRABAL KR DAS IN DEHLI
> >
> > CAMPAIGNERS last night accused the Indian government of betrayal as it
> > prepared to welcome the company behind the Bhopal chemical disaster back to
> > the country.
> >
> > In the early hours of 3 December, 1984, 5,000 people died when a leak at
> > Union Carbide's pesticide plant caused a 40-tonne cloud of toxic gas to
> > descend on the city. It is claimed 20,000 others have since died as a result
> > of continuing pollution from the plant.
> >
> > Activists say there is a new death every day linked to the disaster and
> > that, for 23 years, Union Carbide and its parent company, Dow Chemical, have
> > failed to take responsibility for cleaning up.
> >
> > In 2004, the Indian government brought a court case, demanding Dow pay
> > £10.5 million to clean up the 8,000 tonnes of toxic waste still in the
> > factory and surrounding area.
> >
> > But victims' groups have obtained documents from the office of the prime
> > minister, Manmohan Singh, which they claim show that senior ministers are
> > advocating an out-of-court settlement with Dow that would allow the company
> > to walk away from its responsibilities in Bhopal
> >
> > in return for a proposed £500 million investment in India.
> >
> > The government has signed an agreement with Dow, allowing the firm to
> > establish new research and development bases in Pune, Chennai and Mumbai.
> >
> > Dow has been waging a ferocious lobbying war against the victims'
> > groups, recruiting some of India's most influential tycoons, including Ratan
> > Tata, head of the Tata conglomerate, to lobby ministers on its behalf.
> > Earlier this year, Mr Tata wrote to the government, proposing that a
> > "remediation fund" be established to clean up the site, in order to relieve
> > Dow of its liabilities and allow the company to invest in India.
> >
> > Rachna Dhingra, of the Bhopal Group for Information and Action, said:
> > "In 23 years since the disaster in Bhopal, the government has learned
> > nothing. For 23 years, they have betrayed the people of Bhopal. They are
> > bowing to Dow in the interest of commercial investment in India."
> >
> > Mr Dhingra believes that Dow should not be allowed to do business in
> > India until it cleans up the toxic waste in and around the factory, which,
> >
> > he says, has left local residents suffering from liver and kidney
> > diseases and nervous system disorders.
> >
> > Studies show the rates of cancer and other diseases have risen
> > dramatically in the area since the disaster.
> >
> > Mr Dhingra went on: "25,000 people in the Bhopal area continue to this
> > day to drink contaminated water. They suffer all sorts of serious medical
> > conditions, including respiratory diseases, cancer, blindness and babies
> > born with congenital birth defects.
> >
> > "[Dow] have to pay compensation to the people who continue to live with
> > the effects of the disaster. It's simple: no justice, no business."
> >
> > The victims' campaign was given a boost this year when Indra Sinha's
> > novel Animal's People, which tells of a young man horribly maimed by the
> > disaster, was shortlisted for the Booker prize. The Edinburgh-based author
> > Meaghan Delahunt is also due to publish a novel set in Bhopal.
> > *FIRM BELIEVES FINANCIAL RESPONSIBILITY FULFILLED*
> >
> > DOW Chemical has consistently maintained that it accepts no
> > responsibility for the 1984 disaster. Dow purchased Union Carbide in 2001
> > for $10.3 billion in stock and debt.
> >
> > Dow has publicly stated several times that earlier compensation payments
> > by Union Carbide to the families of those who died on the night have already
> > fulfilled Dow's financial responsibility for the disaster. In reality very
> > little of the money Union Carbide agreed to pay in the immediate aftermath
> > of the disaster found its way to the victims' families.
> >
> > Union Carbide paid on average $500 to the families, but campaigners
> > complain this amount barely covered the immediate costs to the relatives,
> > like funerals.
> >
> > Campaigners see in Dow's return a government's willingness to forget the
> > plight of its own people when tempted by the prospect of major investment.
> > Speaking to The Scotsman, Greenpeace's executive director in India, Ananth
> > Padmanabhan, said: "It is immoral, unethical and shameful that the
> > government of India has favoured foreign direct investment over justice. It
> > is shocking that the government is actually willing to scuttle existing
> > legal cases to facilitate Dow's entry into India." He expressed his
> > confidence that public opinion and the "indomitable will" of the Bhopal
> > victims will succeed in making a difference.
> > *People and the environment will face new threats*
> >
> > PRABUL KR DAS, Assam Tribune staff reporter on placement with The
> > Scotsman, was a communications adviser for Greenpeace during its campaign
> > for victims of Bhopal
> >
> > IN THE race to rapid economic gains, India could well be entering its
> > most dangerous phase of environmental degradation and decay. Significant
> > instances like the Bhopal gas disaster of 1984 make world headlines, but
> > there are similar events in smaller scale happening every day across India;
> > the more remote the place, the more dangerous the situation. Bhopal was the
> > wake-up call for the Indian government, but it did precious little to put
> > pressure on Union Carbide and later Dow Chemical to compensate the victims
> > and to clean up the place.
> >
> > Years later, the government is now keen to invite Dow Chemical to
> > operate in India. Among the journalists who have spent time with the victims
> > of Bhopal, it appears to me as a travesty of justice. But such incidents of
> > the government favouring industry and trade over human and environmental
> > concerns are actually growing more common.
> >
> > In different parts of the country, the industrial juggernaut is making
> > its presence felt more than ever. In the state of West Bengal, a place
> > called Singur witnessed ugly incidents after land was requisitioned from
> > farmers for a car factory. A large number of people lost their traditional
> > means of livelihood. In my state of Assam, inside the famous Kaziranga
> > National Park, which is also a world heritage site, the state government
> > allowed a stone quarry to operate. It raised a huge hue and cry, and along
> > with fellow scribes I produced reports featuring maps and co-ordinates. For
> > a few days the machines stopped ... only to start again.
> >
> > After reporting from around India, I think the interests of human beings
> > and the natural environment are deeply threatened. The smallest of elites
> > have derived benefits while the vulnerable and the marginalised have
> > remained voiceless.
> >
> > One might be compelled to call it the rape of the conscience or of
> > common sense, depending how one looks at it.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Believe it or not, you received this message because you've subscribed
> > to the
> > icjb-planning-3+4lAyCyj6DezusRgbny/IAey6BUdJ7nQH7oEaQurus@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx 
> > mailing list. And also because
> > you're totally cool.
> >
> > But, hey - we can't all be cool ALL the time. So if you'd like to be
> > removed from the list, you can
> > do so yourself. Simply send ANY message to
> > icjb-planning-unsubscribe-3+4lAyCyj6DezusRgbny/IAey6BUdJ7nm7qdpzl9ie0@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >
> > If you're curious about list information and functions (though I can't
> > imagine who would be) you
> > can read all about them (oh, joy!) at 
> > http://lists.studentsforbhopal.org/lists/info/icjb-planning
> > .
> >
> > Justice for Bhopal!
> > www.studentsforbhopal.org
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Abhijit Minakshi
> > About my name: www.geocities.com/abhijit1303/aboutname.txt
> >
> >
>
> >
>


-- 
Abhijit Minakshi
About my name: www.geocities.com/abhijit1303/aboutname.txt

---
"When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the poor
have no food, they call me a Communist. - Hélder Câmara
 



== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 22 2007 7:03 pm 
From: "Vignesh S K"  


Well, I have a couple of friends from Bhopal who always say, that half of
bhopal is lazy to work today because they get or used to get compensation
for the Gas incident....

If the government was really serious about such people's health (which it
should be) why does it wait for a private corporation to spend, why cant
they spend the money, what money are we talking about 10.5 million
dollars... thats about 42 crores, and probably then find ways and means to
get the same borne by the private corporation. I beleive even the bhopal
municipal corporation would have budgets better than this...

Any measure motivated towards correcting yesterday's mistake with another
mistake today is not a solution.  I am somehow convinced when DOW says that

*"Dow has publicly stated several times that earlier compensation payments
by Union Carbide to the families of those who died on the night have already
fulfilled Dow's financial responsibility for the disaster"*

I dont have figures to say that this is true or false... but when you
combine this with the first lines of this mail I think it would convince
any logical person.

On 22/11/2007, Abhijit K <abhijit13-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
wrote:
>
>   Read here:  http://www.studentsforbhopal.org/
>
> Answers to your questions in short (we can't debate in email dear brother,
> however since you asked:)
> * A company buys another company, so it buys all its liabilities. If Dow
> does not own Union carbide's sins, then it is like saying that Since I've
> taken a bath in Ganges, i should not be hanged for killing you.
> * Dow is notorious, you'll find if you you do some internet search.
> * Union carbide paid a pittance compared to its sins. It was cutting on
> the protection measures to "cut-costs" (that is to retain its profits at the
> cost of lives of millions) and thats why the Bhopal tragedy happened.
> * There is an unofficial news that this plant in pune was denied
> permission in US and europe.
> * Politicians corruption, Dow's business are indepedent of each other.
> They might have got money to allow Dow a plant (because so many people are
> protesting!)
> * ...
> - a.
>
> On 11/22/07, Anil <anil.kuchibhatla-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > 
> wrote:
> >
> > i didn't understand why we must resist....
> >
> > if Union Carbide was responsible for the Bhopal gas massacre in 1994,
> > why are we poking our finger at DOW which bought it only in 2001..
> >
> > and I feel DOW's stand that they cannot take up responsibility for the
> > massacre in 1994 is fair enough.. If the money paid by Union Carbide did not
> > reach the families, then its a problem with the Union Carbide system and our
> > own distribution system.. if any thing we need to point out the exact flaws
> > that happened then, and see to it that it does not repeat again..
> >
> > and between paying £10.5 million for cleaning up or £500 million as
> > investment.. I would choose latter.. £10.5 million for cleaning up would
> > probably entirely go into politicians' bank accounts.. and if they were
> > entirely used for cleaning up I don't think it would do much of good to the
> > nation on the larger scale.. whereas £500 million in investment.. that
> > would create many employment opportunities..
> >
> > and for this £500 million by DOW, I think our govt. can spend £10.5
> > million in the cleaning.. and even more, why hasn't the government spent
> > those £10.5 million in cleaning all these 13 yrs.. they could have still
> > forced DOW to pay the govt... then atlesast people wouldn't have been
> > suffering for these 13 yrs as well...
> >
> > this is what I think is the prob.. our govt. took no action so far..
> > they just blamed it on Union Carbide and now DOW.. and no organisation till
> > now put any pressure on the govt.. even if they did, they didn't put
> > sufficient pressure.. even now the articles like the one just posted on the
> > group, though don't mean say anything directly still give subtle
> > implications.. like in this case the govt. getting sold for a £500
> > million investment in India.. whats the govt. going to get out of it?? whats
> > any politician going to get if DOW did indeed invest £500 million in
> > India for their private motives, but ended up doing some good to the
> > unemployed Indians..
> >
> > In light of my arguements above, I ask you all now..
> > "it goes without saying, that WE MUST RESIST." --- Really?? How and
> > Why??
> >
> > Anil
> > A global Indian
> >
> >
> >  On Nov 22, 2007 12:12 PM, Abhijit K < 
> > abhijit13-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> >
> > > Hi all,
> > > As you must be knowing,  DOW CHEMICALS, the parent company of UNION
> > > CARBIDE (the company responsible for Bhopal gas massacre) is back in
> > > India... and they are going to setup a plant near pune.
> > >
> > > it goes without saying, that WE MUST RESIST.  We are definitely going
> > > to resist it here in Pune, through all possible means, and we have started
> > > planning for the same.
> > >
> > > I appeal to all BM-ites, anywhere, to protest in whatever forms
> > > possible.
> > >
> > > - abhijit
> > >
> > > ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> > > From: Shalini Sharma < 
> > > shalini-9geRo0GdX4lFkAh08a1FFZcPDiHTxzko@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > Date: Nov 22, 2007 11:42 AM
> > > Subject: [YSC] India's betryal of Bhopal-Scotsman
> > > To: 
> > > sfbupdates.india-3+4lAyCyj6DezusRgbny/IAey6BUdJ7nQH7oEaQurus@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > >
> > >  *http://news.scotsman.com/international.cfm?id=1835382007 * *India's
> > > betrayal of Bhopal*
> > >
> > > PAMELA TIMMS AND PRABAL KR DAS IN DEHLI
> > >
> > > CAMPAIGNERS last night accused the Indian government of betrayal as it
> > > prepared to welcome the company behind the Bhopal chemical disaster back 
> > > to
> > > the country.
> > >
> > > In the early hours of 3 December, 1984, 5,000 people died when a leak
> > > at Union Carbide's pesticide plant caused a 40-tonne cloud of toxic gas to
> > > descend on the city. It is claimed 20,000 others have since died as a 
> > > result
> > > of continuing pollution from the plant.
> > >
> > > Activists say there is a new death every day linked to the disaster
> > > and that, for 23 years, Union Carbide and its parent company, Dow 
> > > Chemical,
> > > have failed to take responsibility for cleaning up.
> > >
> > > In 2004, the Indian government brought a court case, demanding Dow pay
> > > £10.5 million to clean up the 8,000 tonnes of toxic waste still in the
> > > factory and surrounding area.
> > >
> > > But victims' groups have obtained documents from the office of the
> > > prime minister, Manmohan Singh, which they claim show that senior 
> > > ministers
> > > are advocating an out-of-court settlement with Dow that would allow the
> > > company to walk away from its responsibilities in Bhopal
> > >
> > > in return for a proposed £500 million investment in India.
> > >
> > > The government has signed an agreement with Dow, allowing the firm to
> > > establish new research and development bases in Pune, Chennai and Mumbai.
> > >
> > > Dow has been waging a ferocious lobbying war against the victims'
> > > groups, recruiting some of India's most influential tycoons, including 
> > > Ratan
> > > Tata, head of the Tata conglomerate, to lobby ministers on its behalf.
> > > Earlier this year, Mr Tata wrote to the government, proposing that a
> > > "remediation fund" be established to clean up the site, in order to 
> > > relieve
> > > Dow of its liabilities and allow the company to invest in India.
> > >
> > > Rachna Dhingra, of the Bhopal Group for Information and Action, said:
> > > "In 23 years since the disaster in Bhopal, the government has learned
> > > nothing. For 23 years, they have betrayed the people of Bhopal. They are
> > > bowing to Dow in the interest of commercial investment in India."
> > >
> > > Mr Dhingra believes that Dow should not be allowed to do business in
> > > India until it cleans up the toxic waste in and around the factory, which,
> > >
> > > he says, has left local residents suffering from liver and kidney
> > > diseases and nervous system disorders.
> > >
> > > Studies show the rates of cancer and other diseases have risen
> > > dramatically in the area since the disaster.
> > >
> > > Mr Dhingra went on: "25,000 people in the Bhopal area continue to this
> > > day to drink contaminated water. They suffer all sorts of serious medical
> > > conditions, including respiratory diseases, cancer, blindness and babies
> > > born with congenital birth defects.
> > >
> > > "[Dow] have to pay compensation to the people who continue to live
> > > with the effects of the disaster. It's simple: no justice, no business."
> > >
> > > The victims' campaign was given a boost this year when Indra Sinha's
> > > novel Animal's People, which tells of a young man horribly maimed by the
> > > disaster, was shortlisted for the Booker prize. The Edinburgh-based author
> > > Meaghan Delahunt is also due to publish a novel set in Bhopal.
> > > *FIRM BELIEVES FINANCIAL RESPONSIBILITY FULFILLED*
> > >
> > > DOW Chemical has consistently maintained that it accepts no
> > > responsibility for the 1984 disaster. Dow purchased Union Carbide in 2001
> > > for $10.3 billion in stock and debt.
> > >
> > > Dow has publicly stated several times that earlier compensation
> > > payments by Union Carbide to the families of those who died on the night
> > > have already fulfilled Dow's financial responsibility for the disaster. In
> > > reality very little of the money Union Carbide agreed to pay in the
> > > immediate aftermath of the disaster found its way to the victims' 
> > > families.
> > >
> > > Union Carbide paid on average $500 to the families, but campaigners
> > > complain this amount barely covered the immediate costs to the relatives,
> > > like funerals.
> > >
> > > Campaigners see in Dow's return a government's willingness to forget
> > > the plight of its own people when tempted by the prospect of major
> > > investment. Speaking to The Scotsman, Greenpeace's executive director in
> > > India, Ananth Padmanabhan, said: "It is immoral, unethical and shameful 
> > > that
> > > the government of India has favoured foreign direct investment over 
> > > justice.
> > > It is shocking that the government is actually willing to scuttle existing
> > > legal cases to facilitate Dow's entry into India." He expressed his
> > > confidence that public opinion and the "indomitable will" of the Bhopal
> > > victims will succeed in making a difference.
> > > *People and the environment will face new threats*
> > >
> > > PRABUL KR DAS, Assam Tribune staff reporter on placement with The
> > > Scotsman, was a communications adviser for Greenpeace during its campaign
> > > for victims of Bhopal
> > >
> > > IN THE race to rapid economic gains, India could well be entering its
> > > most dangerous phase of environmental degradation and decay. Significant
> > > instances like the Bhopal gas disaster of 1984 make world headlines, but
> > > there are similar events in smaller scale happening every day across 
> > > India;
> > > the more remote the place, the more dangerous the situation. Bhopal was 
> > > the
> > > wake-up call for the Indian government, but it did precious little to put
> > > pressure on Union Carbide and later Dow Chemical to compensate the victims
> > > and to clean up the place.
> > >
> > > Years later, the government is now keen to invite Dow Chemical to
> > > operate in India. Among the journalists who have spent time with the 
> > > victims
> > > of Bhopal, it appears to me as a travesty of justice. But such incidents 
> > > of
> > > the government favouring industry and trade over human and environmental
> > > concerns are actually growing more common.
> > >
> > > In different parts of the country, the industrial juggernaut is making
> > > its presence felt more than ever. In the state of West Bengal, a place
> > > called Singur witnessed ugly incidents after land was requisitioned from
> > > farmers for a car factory. A large number of people lost their traditional
> > > means of livelihood. In my state of Assam, inside the famous Kaziranga
> > > National Park, which is also a world heritage site, the state government
> > > allowed a stone quarry to operate. It raised a huge hue and cry, and along
> > > with fellow scribes I produced reports featuring maps and co-ordinates. 
> > > For
> > > a few days the machines stopped ... only to start again.
> > >
> > > After reporting from around India, I think the interests of human
> > > beings and the natural environment are deeply threatened. The smallest of
> > > elites have derived benefits while the vulnerable and the marginalised 
> > > have
> > > remained voiceless.
> > >
> > > One might be compelled to call it the rape of the conscience or of
> > > common sense, depending how one looks at it.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ____________________________________________________________
> > > Believe it or not, you received this message because you've subscribed
> > > to the
> > > icjb-planning-3+4lAyCyj6DezusRgbny/IAey6BUdJ7nQH7oEaQurus@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > >  mailing list. And also
> > > because you're totally cool.
> > >
> > > But, hey - we can't all be cool ALL the time. So if you'd like to be
> > > removed from the list, you can
> > > do so yourself. Simply send ANY message to
> > > icjb-planning-unsubscribe-3+4lAyCyj6DezusRgbny/IAey6BUdJ7nm7qdpzl9ie0@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
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> > > can read all about them (oh, joy!) at 
> > > http://lists.studentsforbhopal.org/lists/info/icjb-planning
> > > .
> > >
> > > Justice for Bhopal!
> > > www.studentsforbhopal.org
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Abhijit Minakshi
> > > About my name: www.geocities.com/abhijit1303/aboutname.txt
> > >
> > >
> >
> > > >
> >
>
>
> --
> Abhijit Minakshi
> About my name: www.geocities.com/abhijit1303/aboutname.txt
>
> ---
> "When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the
> poor have no food, they call me a Communist. - Hélder Câmara
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-- 
Thanks and Regards

S.K.Vignesh
 



== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Nov 22 2007 10:52 pm 
From: "Abhijit K"  


Vignesh,
The way suggested by you is very right. So lets ask the government to do it
somehow, but it must come from the pocket of Dow, as it is the company who
was responsible. Remember taxpayer's money and the company's profits are
different things. Also, you should listen to the other side of people and
try to understand why they are saying it. You can't just believe in the
statement of the company (what else can they say !!!!) for the sake of
beleiving in it. The sufferings of the people talk for themselves.
-a.

On 11/23/07, Vignesh S K <skvignesh-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
wrote:
>
> Well, I have a couple of friends from Bhopal who always say, that half of
> bhopal is lazy to work today because they get or used to get compensation
> for the Gas incident....
>
> If the government was really serious about such people's health (which it
> should be) why does it wait for a private corporation to spend, why cant
> they spend the money, what money are we talking about 10.5 million
> dollars... thats about 42 crores, and probably then find ways and means to
> get the same borne by the private corporation. I beleive even the bhopal
> municipal corporation would have budgets better than this...
>
> Any measure motivated towards correcting yesterday's mistake with another
> mistake today is not a solution.  I am somehow convinced when DOW says that
>
> *"Dow has publicly stated several times that earlier compensation payments
> by Union Carbide to the families of those who died on the night have already
> fulfilled Dow's financial responsibility for the disaster" *
>
> I dont have figures to say that this is true or false... but when you
> combine this with the first lines of this mail I think it would convince
> any logical person.
>
> On 22/11/2007, Abhijit K <abhijit13-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > 
> wrote:
>
> >   Read here:  http://www.studentsforbhopal.org/
> >
> > Answers to your questions in short (we can't debate in email dear
> > brother, however since you asked:)
> > * A company buys another company, so it buys all its liabilities. If Dow
> > does not own Union carbide's sins, then it is like saying that Since I've
> > taken a bath in Ganges, i should not be hanged for killing you.
> > * Dow is notorious, you'll find if you you do some internet search.
> > * Union carbide paid a pittance compared to its sins. It was cutting on
> > the protection measures to "cut-costs" (that is to retain its profits at the
> > cost of lives of millions) and thats why the Bhopal tragedy happened.
> > * There is an unofficial news that this plant in pune was denied
> > permission in US and europe.
> > * Politicians corruption, Dow's business are indepedent of each other.
> > They might have got money to allow Dow a plant (because so many people are
> > protesting!)
> > * ...
> > - a.
> >
> >
> > On 11/22/07, Anil <anil.kuchibhatla-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx 
> > > wrote:
> >
> > > i didn't understand why we must resist....
> > >
> > > if Union Carbide was responsible for the Bhopal gas massacre in 1994,
> > > why are we poking our finger at DOW which bought it only in 2001..
> > >
> > > and I feel DOW's stand that they cannot take up responsibility for the
> > > massacre in 1994 is fair enough.. If the money paid by Union Carbide did 
> > > not
> > > reach the families, then its a problem with the Union Carbide system and 
> > > our
> > > own distribution system.. if any thing we need to point out the exact 
> > > flaws
> > > that happened then, and see to it that it does not repeat again..
> > >
> > > and between paying £10.5 million for cleaning up or £500 million as
> > > investment.. I would choose latter.. £10.5 million for cleaning up
> > > would probably entirely go into politicians' bank accounts.. and if they
> > > were entirely used for cleaning up I don't think it would do much of good 
> > > to
> > > the nation on the larger scale.. whereas £500 million in investment..
> > > that would create many employment opportunities..
> > >
> > > and for this £500 million by DOW, I think our govt. can spend £10.5
> > > million in the cleaning.. and even more, why hasn't the government spent
> > > those £10.5 million in cleaning all these 13 yrs.. they could have
> > > still forced DOW to pay the govt... then atlesast people wouldn't have
> > > been suffering for these 13 yrs as well...
> > >
> > > this is what I think is the prob.. our govt. took no action so far..
> > > they just blamed it on Union Carbide and now DOW.. and no organisation 
> > > till
> > > now put any pressure on the govt.. even if they did, they didn't put
> > > sufficient pressure.. even now the articles like the one just posted on 
> > > the
> > > group, though don't mean say anything directly still give subtle
> > > implications.. like in this case the govt. getting sold for a £500
> > > million investment in India.. whats the govt. going to get out of it?? 
> > > whats
> > > any politician going to get if DOW did indeed invest £500 million in
> > > India for their private motives, but ended up doing some good to the
> > > unemployed Indians..
> > >
> > > In light of my arguements above, I ask you all now..
> > > "it goes without saying, that WE MUST RESIST." --- Really?? How and
> > > Why??
> > >
> > > Anil
> > > A global Indian
> > >
> > >
> > >  On Nov 22, 2007 12:12 PM, Abhijit K < 
> > > abhijit13-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hi all,
> > > > As you must be knowing,  DOW CHEMICALS, the parent company of UNION
> > > > CARBIDE (the company responsible for Bhopal gas massacre) is back in
> > > > India... and they are going to setup a plant near pune.
> > > >
> > > > it goes without saying, that WE MUST RESIST.  We are definitely
> > > > going to resist it here in Pune, through all possible means, and we have
> > > > started planning for the same.
> > > >
> > > > I appeal to all BM-ites, anywhere, to protest in whatever forms
> > > > possible.
> > > >
> > > > - abhijit
> > > >
> > > > ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> > > > From: Shalini Sharma < 
> > > > shalini-9geRo0GdX4lFkAh08a1FFZcPDiHTxzko@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > Date: Nov 22, 2007 11:42 AM
> > > > Subject: [YSC] India's betryal of Bhopal-Scotsman
> > > > To: 
> > > > sfbupdates.india-3+4lAyCyj6DezusRgbny/IAey6BUdJ7nQH7oEaQurus@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > >
> > > >  * http://news.scotsman.com/international.cfm?id=1835382007 * *India's
> > > > betrayal of Bhopal*
> > > >
> > > > PAMELA TIMMS AND PRABAL KR DAS IN DEHLI
> > > >
> > > > CAMPAIGNERS last night accused the Indian government of betrayal as
> > > > it prepared to welcome the company behind the Bhopal chemical disaster 
> > > > back
> > > > to the country.
> > > >
> > > > In the early hours of 3 December, 1984, 5,000 people died when a
> > > > leak at Union Carbide's pesticide plant caused a 40-tonne cloud of 
> > > > toxic gas
> > > > to descend on the city. It is claimed 20,000 others have since died as a
> > > > result of continuing pollution from the plant.
> > > >
> > > > Activists say there is a new death every day linked to the disaster
> > > > and that, for 23 years, Union Carbide and its parent company, Dow 
> > > > Chemical,
> > > > have failed to take responsibility for cleaning up.
> > > >
> > > > In 2004, the Indian government brought a court case, demanding Dow
> > > > pay £10.5 million to clean up the 8,000 tonnes of toxic waste still in 
> > > > the
> > > > factory and surrounding area.
> > > >
> > > > But victims' groups have obtained documents from the office of the
> > > > prime minister, Manmohan Singh, which they claim show that senior 
> > > > ministers
> > > > are advocating an out-of-court settlement with Dow that would allow the
> > > > company to walk away from its responsibilities in Bhopal
> > > >
> > > > in return for a proposed £500 million investment in India.
> > > >
> > > > The government has signed an agreement with Dow, allowing the firm
> > > > to establish new research and development bases in Pune, Chennai and 
> > > > Mumbai.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Dow has been waging a ferocious lobbying war against the victims'
> > > > groups, recruiting some of India's most influential tycoons, including 
> > > > Ratan
> > > > Tata, head of the Tata conglomerate, to lobby ministers on its behalf.
> > > > Earlier this year, Mr Tata wrote to the government, proposing that a
> > > > "remediation fund" be established to clean up the site, in order to 
> > > > relieve
> > > > Dow of its liabilities and allow the company to invest in India.
> > > >
> > > > Rachna Dhingra, of the Bhopal Group for Information and Action,
> > > > said: "In 23 years since the disaster in Bhopal, the government has 
> > > > learned
> > > > nothing. For 23 years, they have betrayed the people of Bhopal. They are
> > > > bowing to Dow in the interest of commercial investment in India."
> > > >
> > > > Mr Dhingra believes that Dow should not be allowed to do business in
> > > > India until it cleans up the toxic waste in and around the factory, 
> > > > which,
> > > >
> > > > he says, has left local residents suffering from liver and kidney
> > > > diseases and nervous system disorders.
> > > >
> > > > Studies show the rates of cancer and other diseases have risen
> > > > dramatically in the area since the disaster.
> > > >
> > > > Mr Dhingra went on: "25,000 people in the Bhopal area continue to
> > > > this day to drink contaminated water. They suffer all sorts of serious
> > > > medical conditions, including respiratory diseases, cancer, blindness 
> > > > and
> > > > babies born with congenital birth defects.
> > > >
> > > > "[Dow] have to pay compensation to the people who continue to live
> > > > with the effects of the disaster. It's simple: no justice, no business."
> > > >
> > > > The victims' campaign was given a boost this year when Indra Sinha's
> > > > novel Animal's People, which tells of a young man horribly maimed by the
> > > > disaster, was shortlisted for the Booker prize. The Edinburgh-based 
> > > > author
> > > > Meaghan Delahunt is also due to publish a novel set in Bhopal.
> > > > *FIRM BELIEVES FINANCIAL RESPONSIBILITY FULFILLED*
> > > >
> > > > DOW Chemical has consistently maintained that it accepts no
> > > > responsibility for the 1984 disaster. Dow purchased Union Carbide in 
> > > > 2001
> > > > for $10.3 billion in stock and debt.
> > > >
> > > > Dow has publicly stated several times that earlier compensation
> > > > payments by Union Carbide to the families of those who died on the night
> > > > have already fulfilled Dow's financial responsibility for the disaster. 
> > > > In
> > > > reality very little of the money Union Carbide agreed to pay in the
> > > > immediate aftermath of the disaster found its way to the victims' 
> > > > families.
> > > >
> > > > Union Carbide paid on average $500 to the families, but campaigners
> > > > complain this amount barely covered the immediate costs to the 
> > > > relatives,
> > > > like funerals.
> > > >
> > > > Campaigners see in Dow's return a government's willingness to forget
> > > > the plight of its own people when tempted by the prospect of major
> > > > investment. Speaking to The Scotsman, Greenpeace's executive director in
> > > > India, Ananth Padmanabhan, said: "It is immoral, unethical and shameful 
> > > > that
> > > > the government of India has favoured foreign direct investment over 
> > > > justice.
> > > > It is shocking that the government is actually willing to scuttle 
> > > > existing
> > > > legal cases to facilitate Dow's entry into India." He expressed his
> > > > confidence that public opinion and the "indomitable will" of the Bhopal
> > > > victims will succeed in making a difference.
> > > > *People and the environment will face new threats*
> > > >
> > > > PRABUL KR DAS, Assam Tribune staff reporter on placement with The
> > > > Scotsman, was a communications adviser for Greenpeace during its 
> > > > campaign
> > > > for victims of Bhopal
> > > >
> > > > IN THE race to rapid economic gains, India could well be entering
> > > > its most dangerous phase of environmental degradation and decay. 
> > > > Significant
> > > > instances like the Bhopal gas disaster of 1984 make world headlines, but
> > > > there are similar events in smaller scale happening every day across 
> > > > India;
> > > > the more remote the place, the more dangerous the situation. Bhopal was 
> > > > the
> > > > wake-up call for the Indian government, but it did precious little to 
> > > > put
> > > > pressure on Union Carbide and later Dow Chemical to compensate the 
> > > > victims
> > > > and to clean up the place.
> > > >
> > > > Years later, the government is now keen to invite Dow Chemical to
> > > > operate in India. Among the journalists who have spent time with the 
> > > > victims
> > > > of Bhopal, it appears to me as a travesty of justice. But such 
> > > > incidents of
> > > > the government favouring industry and trade over human and environmental
> > > > concerns are actually growing more common.
> > > >
> > > > In different parts of the country, the industrial juggernaut is
> > > > making its presence felt more than ever. In the state of West Bengal, a
> > > > place called Singur witnessed ugly incidents after land was 
> > > > requisitioned
> > > > from farmers for a car factory. A large number of people lost their
> > > > traditional means of livelihood. In my state of Assam, inside the famous
> > > > Kaziranga National Park, which is also a world heritage site, the state
> > > > government allowed a stone quarry to operate. It raised a huge hue and 
> > > > cry,
> > > > and along with fellow scribes I produced reports featuring maps and
> > > > co-ordinates. For a few days the machines stopped ... only to start 
> > > > again.
> > > >
> > > > After reporting from around India, I think the interests of human
> > > > beings and the natural environment are deeply threatened. The smallest 
> > > > of
> > > > elites have derived benefits while the vulnerable and the marginalised 
> > > > have
> > > > remained voiceless.
> > > >
> > > > One might be compelled to call it the rape of the conscience or of
> > > > common sense, depending how one looks at it.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ____________________________________________________________
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> > > > Justice for Bhopal!
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> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Abhijit Minakshi
> > > > About my name: www.geocities.com/abhijit1303/aboutname.txt
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > www.geocities.com/abhijit1303/aboutname.txt
> > >
> > > ---
> > "When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the
> > poor have no food, they call me a Communist. - Hélder Câmara
> >
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> >
>


-- 
Abhijit Minakshi
About my name: www.geocities.com/abhijit1303/aboutname.txt

---
"When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the poor
have no food, they call me a Communist. - Hélder Câmara
 



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