RE: How do you choose your programming language ?

I am not sure you are correct. I believe that in latest java there is a trick 
with
the classloader that you can allocate and free objects, however I heard
that it can lead to memory leak (whats new). I also heard that there are 
alternative
GC and that there are calls that can expedite GC.
Anyway, as I mentioned before there are native compilers that makes all these
a mute discussion, e.g. GCJ. And, its FOSS.

Personally the most important reason I like JAVA is that you can find the bugs 
quickly
and develop quickly using Jbuilder which is the best (although you have to pay).

Regards,
        tzahi. 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: hackers-il-hHKSG33TihhbjbujkaE4pw@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx 
> [mailto:hackers-il-hHKSG33TihhbjbujkaE4pw@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of 
> Nadav Har'El
> Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 6:35 PM
> To: hackers-il-hHKSG33TihhbjbujkaE4pw@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: [hackers-il] How do you choose your programming 
> language ?
> 
> On Wed, Nov 23, 2005, Zohar Kelrich wrote about "Re: 
> [hackers-il] How do you choose your programming language ?":
> > Actually, the Java spec says nothing whatsoever about what sort of  
> > implementation the GC should have; its only GC "contract" 
> is, IIRC,  
> > no object gets finalized more than once.
> > You're free to free (as it were)  objects at the end of 
> every method,  
> > if you so choose.
> 
> Just like understanding human languages requires several 
> levels (syntax,
> semantics, pragmatics, and world knowledge), so does understanding a
> programming language. You cannot realisticly seperate a 
> language and its
> syntax from the language's standard library, and accepted practices.
> Also, the syntax and semantics it provides, or doesn't 
> provide, implies on
> the way people use it, and therefore on the way typical 
> programs are written
> in this language.
> 
> In this example, one very fundamental point about Java is 
> that there is no
> free() call and no objects that live only for the duration of a single
> scoped (such as "automatic" (on-stack) variables in C/C++, or 
> "autoptr" in
> C++). So generally, a user cannot do what you describe in 
> Java (he has no
> free() function), and every Java implementation, whether an 
> "interpreter" or
> "compiler", CANNOT do what you describe in the general case. Because,
> imagine the following piece:
> 
>       {
>               Thing a = new Thing(17);
>               counter+=someobject.doSomethingWith(a);
>       }
> 
> Can a be freed automatically right after this block (by an 
> interpreter or
> a compiler, it doesn't matter)? It's not easy to decide. It depends on
> what doSomethingWith() does. Typically, what this method does 
> is not known
> during compilation of the individual classes. Also, 
> someobject might be of
> different classes (because of inheritence) and each of these 
> classes' method
> might do something else. But even if you know exactly which 
> method is called,
> it's still not easy to know if a pointer to a is kept. 
> Perhaps that method
> calls other methods with a, or with parts of a as parameters, 
> and these
> methods saves pointers?
> 
> Don't understand me wrong - the very fact that everything in Java is a
> reference, and there're no error-prone pointers/autopointers/automatic
> variables/malloc-free, and no chance to accidentally use an 
> out-of-date
> pointer or forget to free one - is what makes Java different, 
> and easier to
> write than languages like C++. It's a deliberate design 
> decision, and not
> an implementation mistake.  But at the same time, it's what makes it a
> memory hog.
> 
> -- 
> Nadav Har'El                        |  Wednesday, Nov 23 
> 2005, 22 Heshvan 5766
> nyh-TS7m/3hpY0sOpacJJkBjfT4kX+cae0hd@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx             
> |-----------------------------------------
> Phone +972-523-790466, ICQ 13349191 |My password is my dog's 
> name. His name is
> http://nadav.harel.org.il           |a#j!4@h, but I change it 
> every month.
> 
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