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Re: Fineract CN Functional Spec for Group Lending Support


Hello Tancred,

Thanks for the work you are doing on gathering requirements for group
lending/management.

It will be a good idea to create a wiki page on confluence and paste all
your requirements. Google docs is not ideal. You can use the existing page
for group lending.
Ed can direct you. Am currently not with my computer.

Thanks.

On Thu, May 24, 2018, 21:00 Tancred Bastrup-Birk <tebb89@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> Dear Mifos and Fineract developer community,
>
> I hope you are all well.
>
> Please find a shareable link to the start of a Requirements document I have
> been working on for Mifos Generation 3 Fineract Group Lending in Google Doc
> format, with the option to comment:
>
> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1PFoh8cS1alrJ44cSfoYtO4LNjbHHtFwnxLPt0lZPvEo/edit?usp=sharing
>
> It would be much appreciated if you could please review the document and
> suggest amendments/improvements as well as flag anything which is unclear.
>
> If there are also any preferences in formatting/ content type please do let
> me know so I can take this into consideration as we move forward with the
> Requirements document.
>
> Please do let me know if you have any questions or any issues with the link
> above.
>
> Thank you very much in advance for your help!
>
> Kind regards,
> Tancred
>
>
> On Thu, May 24, 2018 at 12:52 PM, Ruphine Kengne <ruphinekengne@xxxxxxxxx>
> wrote:
>
> > Hello Ed,
> >
> > I have had the chance to review the document shared by Tancred. I will do
> > some adjustments to the design I have so far for the Group loan
> management
> > system and I will ask questions concerning any doubts I encounter.
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > Ruphine Kengne
> >
> > On Wed, May 23, 2018, 12:48 PM Pembe Miriam <pembemiriam007@xxxxxxxxx>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Hello Tancred,
> >>
> >> Like what Ed said please share the document to the Mifos and Fineract
> dev
> >> lists so that everyone can review.
> >>
> >> Yours Sincerely,
> >> Pembe Miriam
> >>
> >> On Wed, May 23, 2018 at 10:59 AM, Pembe Miriam <
> pembemiriam007@xxxxxxxxx>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Hello,
> >>>
> >>> Thanks Tancred, I have gone through the document and it is a good one,
> >>> though I have not fully understood everything about it but I know that
> as I
> >>> move on with my work I will get to understand things more and will also
> >>> keep in touch if I need clarity about anything so that I should not be
> >>> going to the wrong direction.
> >>>
> >>> Yours Sincerely,
> >>> Pembe Miriam
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Mon, May 21, 2018 at 3:48 PM, Ed Cable <edcable@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Thanks Tancred,
> >>>>
> >>>> I missed this email. Can you share this to the public Mifos dev and
> >>>> Fineract dev lists?
> >>>>
> >>>> Ruphine/Pembe, have you had a chance to review?
> >>>>
> >>>> Ed
> >>>>
> >>>> On Sun, May 13, 2018 at 1:01 PM Tancred Bastrup-Birk <
> tebb89@xxxxxxxxx>
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> Hi Ed,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I hope you are well.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Thanks for checking in.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I did not see any replies come through. I have, however, made a start
> >>>>> on high level requirements for Generation 3 Fineract CN Group
> Lending in
> >>>>> the meantime.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Could you please review the attachment when you get a chance to see
> if
> >>>>> I am on the right track?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Thank you very much in advance!
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Kind regards,
> >>>>> Tancred
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Fri, May 11, 2018 at 1:53 AM, Ed Cable <edcable@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Tancred,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Did you get any replies from folks like Ashok, Nayan, Amit etc. to
> >>>>>> help in this task?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Ed
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 11:53 PM, Tancred Bastrup-Birk <
> >>>>>> tebb89@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Hello all,
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> It is nice to meet you all over email and I look forward to working
> >>>>>>> with you!
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Ed, thank you very much for the introduction. Ashok and Nayan, I
> >>>>>>> look forward to receiving your feedback.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> I am currently working through consolidating the Generation 1 and
> >>>>>>> Generation 2 specs for Group Lending Support, along with
> identifying
> >>>>>>> opportunities for any improvements with the new Fineract CN
> architecture.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> As Ed mentioned I would be keen to hear from current users, both
> >>>>>>> from the perspective of users at MFIs offering group lending and
> users who
> >>>>>>> have group accounts.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> I am flexible in terms of timings for calls so if you would be
> >>>>>>> interested in discussing your Group Lending requirements as a
> Mifos user,
> >>>>>>> please do get in touch.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Kind regards,
> >>>>>>> Tancred
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 12:10 AM, Ed Cable <edcable@xxxxxxxxx>
> >>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Hi all,
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> I wanted to bump this thread to the top once more as it's critical
> >>>>>>>> part of the journey to parity and I was hoping for some input
> from partners
> >>>>>>>> and users in our community who have been focused on these
> methodologies for
> >>>>>>>> better of the past decade. Ashok and Nayan will soon be providing
> some
> >>>>>>>> feedback on this thread.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> I also have a product management volunteer, Tancred, who is
> willing
> >>>>>>>> to jump on some calls with folks and document your requirements
> and
> >>>>>>>> consolidate requirements from the previous two generations of
> software
> >>>>>>>> along with the needs of other group-based methodologies all in
> the context
> >>>>>>>> of the new Fineract CN architecture. Getting a clear spec in
> space is
> >>>>>>>> critical for equipping any future contributors/interns to work on
> such
> >>>>>>>> projects. I've cc'd Tancred on this email.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> As we seek to come to consensus of how we can extract the
> strengths
> >>>>>>>> of Fineract 1.x and its support of group-based operations and
> layer on them
> >>>>>>>> greater flexibility and benefits of the new architecture, we'll
> consider
> >>>>>>>> some of the following questions:
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> *Group FormationAdministration*
> >>>>>>>> - Formation of the Group
> >>>>>>>> - Existence within the Center Hierarchy
> >>>>>>>> - Group Details Tracking (Officers, Attendance, Training, etc)
> >>>>>>>> - Transfers/Interactions of Clients Across Groups
> >>>>>>>> - Clients belonging to one or multiple groups.
> >>>>>>>> - Permission of Loan Officers/Data Scoping Related to Groups
> >>>>>>>> - Assigning of Loan Officers to Groups.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> *Calendar/Meeting*
> >>>>>>>> - At what level is this tracked - what activities can occur during
> >>>>>>>> a meeting, how interlinked to repayment schedule is the meeting,
> etc.
> >>>>>>>> - Collection Sheet Functionality - Generating collection sheet
> >>>>>>>> report and bulk entry interface for group/center data
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> *Accounting at Group Level*
> >>>>>>>> - Here is where we had the biggest gap between support for joint
> >>>>>>>> liability group lending and what was needing for savings groups
> to allow
> >>>>>>>> for bookkeeping and settlement at the group level.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> *Loan Product Management*
> >>>>>>>> - Just as we've done with Fineract 1.x - all loan parameterization
> >>>>>>>> that is available to an individual loan should be available at a
> group loan
> >>>>>>>> level as well. Likewise, charges, collateral tracking, guarantors
> should
> >>>>>>>> all function similarly for group as it does individuals.
> >>>>>>>> - Likewise for deposit product management, I would assume a group
> >>>>>>>> or center is just another entity that you could then attach
> savings or
> >>>>>>>> deposit account too.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> *Monitoring at Account Level *
> >>>>>>>> - This is where we get into the distinctions between the various
> >>>>>>>> forms of group loans in this wiki page (
> >>>>>>>> https://mifosforge.jira.com/wiki/spaces/MIFOSX/pages/
> >>>>>>>> 31358990/Loan+Tracking+strategies) and where complexity and
> >>>>>>>> confusion comes in - at what level of tracking is done, loan at
> group or
> >>>>>>>> individual level, co-liability amongst borrowers/group members,
> are
> >>>>>>>> individual amounts different, is there a repayment schedule at an
> >>>>>>>> individual or group level, does the loan get counted in the loan
> cycle
> >>>>>>>> counter/go into their credit history, etc.
> >>>>>>>> - At what level do repayments occur - for integrations with mobile
> >>>>>>>> money, this is an important distinction to make.
> >>>>>>>> - Loan Cycle Counter & Linkage to Graduation
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> On Fri, Mar 9, 2018 at 3:51 PM, Ed Cable <edcable@xxxxxxxxx>
> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Hello all,
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> I want to put this out to the community to assist with so we can
> >>>>>>>>> move forward with implementing group lending support on Fineract
> CN which
> >>>>>>>>> is one of the key paths forward with parity between Fineract CN
> and
> >>>>>>>>> Fineract 1.x.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Can you please help draft the spec for group-based operational
> >>>>>>>>> methodologies
> >>>>>>>>> <
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/FINERACT/Group-Based+Financial+Inclusion+Methodologies
> >
> >>>>>>>>> ?
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> It's also a barrier for students who are applying to a potential
> >>>>>>>>> GSOC project around a web UI for group lending support.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> We have more than a decade of learning and knowledge of
> >>>>>>>>> implementing proper group lending support from our original gen
> 1 software
> >>>>>>>>> (Mifos 2.x) and our gen 2 software (Mifos X/Fineract 1.x) so I
> don't want
> >>>>>>>>> us to throw away all that knowledge and think we have to
> completely
> >>>>>>>>> re-invent the wheel.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> However I do want us take the learnings we implemented from the
> >>>>>>>>> transition to Gen 1 to Gen 2 as well as the
> learnings/improvements we want
> >>>>>>>>> to make off of Gen 2. We also want to bear in mind not just
> support
> >>>>>>>>> traditional JLGs/Solidarity groups but also Savings Groups,
> Village
> >>>>>>>>> Banking, Self Help Groups, etc.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> I know that across the community we have both technical as well
> as
> >>>>>>>>> operational individuals who are experts in these matters so I
> really want
> >>>>>>>>> to challenge you all to assist the community in this regard. To
> get
> >>>>>>>>> everyone started, I'm putting in place a wiki page at
> >>>>>>>>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/FINERACT/
> >>>>>>>>> Group-Based+Financial+Inclusion+Methodologies to house the spec
> >>>>>>>>> and also linking to all the past specs/pseudo-requirements
> documents from
> >>>>>>>>> before.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Generation 1 - Mifos 2.x
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>    - Group Accounts FS: http://mifosx.openmf.org/
> >>>>>>>>>    Mifos%20website/mifos.org/functional-specifications/
> >>>>>>>>>    account-management/group-accounts.html
> >>>>>>>>>    <
> http://mifosx.openmf.org/Mifos%20website/mifos.org/functional-specifications/account-management/group-accounts.html
> >
> >>>>>>>>>    or https://mifosforge.jira.com/wiki/
> >>>>>>>>>    spaces/MIFOS/pages/73466196/Group+Accounts
> >>>>>>>>>    <
> https://mifosforge.jira.com/wiki/spaces/MIFOS/pages/73466196/Group+Accounts
> >
> >>>>>>>>>    - Center Accounts FS: http://mifosx.openmf.org/
> >>>>>>>>>    Mifos%20website/mifos.org/functional-specifications/
> >>>>>>>>>    account-management/center-accounts.html
> >>>>>>>>>    <
> http://mifosx.openmf.org/Mifos%20website/mifos.org/functional-specifications/account-management/center-accounts.html
> >
> >>>>>>>>>    - GLIM: https://mifosforge.jira.com/wiki/spaces/MIFOS/pages/
> >>>>>>>>>    4456859/GLIM+Functional+Specification
> >>>>>>>>>    <
> https://mifosforge.jira.com/wiki/spaces/MIFOS/pages/4456859/GLIM+Functional+Specification
> >
> >>>>>>>>>    and https://mifosforge.jira.com/wiki/
> >>>>>>>>>    spaces/MIFOS/pages/4456866/Group+loan+with+individual+
> >>>>>>>>>    monitoring
> >>>>>>>>>    <
> https://mifosforge.jira.com/wiki/spaces/MIFOS/pages/4456866/Group+loan+with+individual+monitoring
> >
> >>>>>>>>>    - Loans: https://mifosforge.jira.com/wiki/spaces/MIFOS/
> >>>>>>>>>    pages/7700948/Loans
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Generation 2 - Mifos X
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>    - Groups API: https://demo.openmf.org/
> >>>>>>>>>    api-docs/apiLive.htm#groups
> >>>>>>>>>    - Groups & Centers User Manual: https://mifosforge.
> >>>>>>>>>    jira.com/wiki/spaces/docs/pages/52035634/Clients+Groups+
> >>>>>>>>>    and+Centers
> >>>>>>>>>    <
> https://mifosforge.jira.com/wiki/spaces/docs/pages/52035634/Clients+Groups+and+Centers
> >
> >>>>>>>>>    - Loan Tracking Strategies: https://mifosforge.jira.com/wiki/
> >>>>>>>>>    spaces/MIFOSX/pages/31358990/Loan+Tracking+strategies
> >>>>>>>>>    <
> https://mifosforge.jira.com/wiki/spaces/MIFOSX/pages/31358990/Loan+Tracking+strategies
> >
> >>>>>>>>>    - Group Loan FS (early-stage): https://
> >>>>>>>>>    mifosforge.jira.com/wiki/spaces/MIFOS/pages/28213252/
> >>>>>>>>>    New+Group+Loan+Functional+Specification
> >>>>>>>>>    <
> https://mifosforge.jira.com/wiki/spaces/MIFOS/pages/28213252/New+Group+Loan+Functional+Specification
> >
> >>>>>>>>>    and https://mifosforge.jira.com/wiki/
> >>>>>>>>>    spaces/MIFOSX/pages/25821209/Group+Lending+MifosX+FS
> >>>>>>>>>    <
> https://mifosforge.jira.com/wiki/spaces/MIFOSX/pages/25821209/Group+Lending+MifosX+FS
> >
> >>>>>>>>>    - Self-Funded Groups: https://mifosforge.
> >>>>>>>>>    jira.com/wiki/spaces/MIFOSX/pages/113017056/Self-Funded+
> >>>>>>>>>    Groups+SHGs+Savings+Groups+VSLAs
> >>>>>>>>>    <
> https://mifosforge.jira.com/wiki/spaces/MIFOSX/pages/113017056/Self-Funded+Groups+SHGs+Savings+Groups+VSLAs
> >
> >>>>>>>>>       - Savings Groups per DreamStart Labs Requirements (Design
> >>>>>>>>>       for Fineract Data Model)
> >>>>>>>>>          - Savings Requirements v1.1
> >>>>>>>>>          <
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/download/attachments/75975654/Mifos_SG_Reqs_v1.1_edits.docx?version=1&modificationDate=1520639290346&api=v2
> >Savings
> >>>>>>>>>          Groups Requirements v1.1 Dreamstart Labs
> >>>>>>>>>          <
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/download/attachments/75975654/Mifos_SG_Reqs_v1.1_edits.docx?version=1&modificationDate=1520639290346&api=v2
> >
> >>>>>>>>>           Labs
> >>>>>>>>>          <
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/download/attachments/75975654/Mifos_SG_Reqs_v1.1_edits.docx?version=1&modificationDate=1520639290346&api=v2
> >
> >>>>>>>>>          - Savings Groups User Stories
> >>>>>>>>>          <
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/download/attachments/75975654/SHG_UserStories_Design.docx?version=1&modificationDate=1520639343727&api=v2
> >
> >>>>>>>>>          - Savings Groups Estimates
> >>>>>>>>>          <
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/download/attachments/75975654/SHG%20Estimates.xlsx?version=1&modificationDate=1520639352132&api=v2
> >
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Ed
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>>> *Ed Cable*
> >>>>>>>>> President/CEO, Mifos Initiative
> >>>>>>>>> edcable@xxxxxxxxx | Skype: edcable | Mobile: +1.484.477.8649
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> *Collectively Creating a World of 3 Billion Maries | *
> >>>>>>>>> http://mifos.org  <http://facebook.com/mifos>
> >>>>>>>>> <http://www.twitter.com/mifos>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>> *Ed Cable*
> >>>>>>>> President/CEO, Mifos Initiative
> >>>>>>>> edcable@xxxxxxxxx | Skype: edcable | Mobile: +1.484.477.8649
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> *Collectively Creating a World of 3 Billion Maries | *
> >>>>>>>> http://mifos.org  <http://facebook.com/mifos>
> >>>>>>>> <http://www.twitter.com/mifos>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> --
> >>>>>> *Ed Cable*
> >>>>>> President/CEO, Mifos Initiative
> >>>>>> edcable@xxxxxxxxx | Skype: edcable | Mobile: +1.484.477.8649
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> *Collectively Creating a World of 3 Billion Maries | *
> >>>>>> http://mifos.org  <http://facebook.com/mifos>
> >>>>>> <http://www.twitter.com/mifos>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> *Ed Cable*
> >>>> President/CEO, Mifos Initiative
> >>>> edcable@xxxxxxxxx | Skype: edcable | Mobile: +1.484.477.8649
> >>>>
> >>>> *Collectively Creating a World of 3 Billion Maries | *
> http://mifos.org
> >>>> <http://facebook.com/mifos>  <http://www.twitter.com/mifos>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>
>