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Re: [DISCUSS] deployment planner improvement


Sorry the late reply, I was kind of swamped.

Been there, done that. I would not change the deployment/allocation
planners as they focus in the start phase. Their goal is to find a place to
put the VM when it is starting and that is it. On the other hand, to
execute live optimization as the system (cloud configuration)changes over
time… Well, that is something else…

I have been researching that in my Ph.D., and we basically ignore the start
(allocation/deployment of VMs) and focus on live balancing, distribution,
or consolidation of workloads (VMs). We have developed a prototype that
worked altogether in ACS. It was developed as a plugin for ACS [1]. There
you can find the whole structure we used, and the callbacks we created to
enable the development of workload management techniques
(heuristics/methods, or whatever name you use to describe something that
guides a software agent to balance/unbalance /consolidate workloads). This
plugin should work in ACS 4.11/master already. Therefore, it would be a
matter of implementing this interface [2] with your requirements.

We moved away from that though. Adding that kind of complexity in ACS
seemed too much. Moreover, we would restrict any solution to work only with
ACS. Therefore, we created something else that uses cloud orchestrators API
(OpenStack or CloudStack) to gather data, process it, and then execute
optimization tasks.

Are you going to be in Montreal next week? We would be happy to collaborate
with you. I can help you get the plugin developed in [1] running with ACS
4.11 or master, or we can share with you the other software as well.


[1] https://github.com/Autonomiccs/autonomiccs-platform
[2]
https://github.com/Autonomiccs/autonomiccs-platform/blob/master/autonomic-administration-algorithms/src/main/java/br/com/autonomiccs/autonomic/administration/algorithms/ClusterAdministrationHeuristicAlgorithm.java

On Fri, Sep 7, 2018 at 3:39 PM, Pierre-Luc Dion <pdion@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> #scopecreep Paul ;)
>
> But I think the problem you identify is related to selection of the
> deployment planner strategy, globally define or at the compute offering.
> You can select how cloudstack choose the host to deploy a new vm.
>
> But even then, like marcus stated, if you add a node to a full cluster, all
> new vm will be created on that node.
>
> So if nobody have WIP around post deployment orchestration, I'll work on
> the feature spec with the university, with objective in mind to easy
> hypervisor maintenances, better distribution of workload.
>
> I would not expect PR before ~6months, but will have some actions around it
> very soon I hope.
>
>
>
> Le ven. 7 sept. 2018 09 h 05, Marc-Andre Jutras <marcus@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> a
> écrit :
>
> > I agree, it is affecting all hypervisor... I basically had to migrate a
> > bunch of vm manually to re-balance a cluster after an upgrade or even
> > after re-adding new host to a cluster.
> >
> > Personally, I think Cloudstack should be able to handles this <auto-re
> > balancing> of resource, example: having a piece of code somewhere that
> > can run every hours or on demand to re-calculate and re-balance
> > resources across hosts within a cluster...
> >
> > Even the deployment planner is not really relevant here: this process
> > will basically balance new VM creation through different clusters of a
> > POD, not between hosts within a cluster and it's also becoming a
> > nightmare when you start to do cross-cluster migration...
> >
> > Sum of all : The deployment strategies planner should be re-worked a
> bit...
> >
> > +1 on #scoopcreep ;)
> >
> > Marcus ( mjutras@xxxxxxxxxxxx )
> >
> > On 2018-09-07 6:01 AM, Paul Angus wrote:
> > > I think that this affects all hypervisors as CloudStack's deployment
> > strategies are generally sub-optimal to say the least.
> > >  From what our devs have told me, a large part of the problem is that
> > capacity/usage and suitability due to tags is calculated by multiple
> parts
> > of the code independently, there is no central method, which will give a
> > consistent answer.
> > >
> > > In Trillian we take a micro-management approach and have a custom
> module
> > which will return the least used cluster, the least used host or the
> least
> > used host in a given cluster.  With that info we place VMs on a specific
> > hosts - keeping virtualised hypervisors in the same cluster (least used)
> so
> > that processor types match, and all other VMs on the least used hosts.
> > >
> > > For cross-cluster migrations (VMs and/or storage) I think that most
> > times people want to move from cluster A to the least used
> > (cluster/storage) in cluster B - making them choose which host/pool is
> > actually unhelpful.
> > >
> > > #scopecreep - sorry Pierre-Luc
> > >
> > > Kind regards,
> > >
> > > Paul Angus
> > >
> > > paul.angus@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > www.shapeblue.com
> > > Amadeus House, Floral Street, London  WC2E 9DPUK
> > > @shapeblue
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Will Stevens <wstevens@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > Sent: 06 September 2018 19:45
> > > To: dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx; Marc-Andre Jutras <mjutras@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> >
> > > Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] deployment planner improvement
> > >
> > > If I remember correctly, we see similar issues on VMware.  Marcus, have
> > you seen similar behavior on VMware?  I think I remember us having to
> > manually vMotion a lot of VMs very often...
> > >
> > > *Will Stevens*
> > > Chief Technology Officer
> > > c 514.826.0190
> > >
> > > <https://goo.gl/NYZ8KK>
> > >
> > >
> > > On Thu, Sep 6, 2018 at 2:34 PM Pierre-Luc Dion <pdion@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > >> Hi,
> > >>
> > >> I'm working with a University in Montreal and we are looking at
> > >> working together to improve the deployment planner. Mainly for post
> > >> VM.CREATE tasks.
> > >> Because  what we observed with cloudstack, in our case with XenServer,
> > >> overtime, a cluster will become unbalanced in therm of workload, vm HA
> > >> will move VMs all over the the cluster which cause hotspot inside a
> > cluster.
> > >> Also, when performing maintenance  xenmotion of VM spread them in the
> > >> cluster but does not consider host usage and at the end of a
> > >> maintenance it require manual operation to repopulate VMs on the last
> > >> host updated.  OS preference not taken into account  except for
> > VM.CREATE.
> > >>
> > >> So,
> > >> I'd like to work on improving VMs dispersion during and post outage
> > >> and maintenances. when a cluster resources are added or removed.
> > >>
> > >> Would you have any more requirement, we will document a feature spec
> > >> in the wiki which I believe it's still a requirement ?
> > >>
> > >> Does using KVM have similar issues over time?
> > >>
> > >> I don't think it would make sense to cloudstack to automatically take
> > >> decision on moving VMs but for now create report of recommended action
> > >> to do and provide steps to do them. tbd.
> > >>
> > >> Cheers,
> > >>
> > >> PL
> > >>
> >
> >
>



-- 
Rafael Weingärtner