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Re: [DISCUSS] Concerns about the Arrow Slack channel


I have just started a vote about closing the channel.

On Tue, Jun 26, 2018 at 11:03 AM, Wes McKinney <wesmckinn@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> I would personally prefer to have all questions on the mailing list
> for now. I don't know if the community is large enough to provide
> consistent attention on an additional communication channel. If there
> end up being too many user-centric questions on dev@, we can activate
> and use user@ as some other projects (like Spark) do.
>
> I see Discourse as a longer-term possibility. We also need to see if
> ASF Infrastructure will support it, which would be the ideal route.
>
> - Wes
>
> On Tue, Jun 26, 2018 at 10:55 AM, Dhruv Madeka <madeka@xxxxxxx> wrote:
>> It might be nice to have the discourse option before shutting it down. As
>> someone who asks, that would be a nice way to get me to migrate
>>
>> On Tue, Jun 26, 2018 at 10:53 AM, Wes McKinney <wesmckinn@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>
>>> hi folks,
>>>
>>> How would you like to proceed on the Slack channel discussion? It
>>> seems there is reasonable consensus to close the channel. Should we
>>> have a vote?
>>>
>>> It would be a good idea to export the data / chat history from the
>>> channel before closing it down.
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>> Wes
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 11:36 PM, Wes McKinney <wesmckinn@xxxxxxxxx>
>>> wrote:
>>> > It's sort of unrelated to this conversation, but since someone
>>> > mentioned MXNet I want to call attention to a thread on their podling
>>> > mailing list about JIRA vs. GitHub issues:
>>> > https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/b4d174223d68c5822ea538f2609281
>>> c8023c7cc1eaef298bb2c4c186@%3Cdev.mxnet.apache.org%3E.
>>> >
>>> > To summarize the thread: a lot of people don't like change, but
>>> > sometimes change is good. Some people have complained privately to me
>>> > that Arrow doesn't work like any other random project on GitHub.
>>> > Anyone who doesn't contribute to the project on account of that is,
>>> > IMHO, not a serious contributor.
>>> >
>>> > I personally find JIRA to be an excellent tool, but it's a steeper
>>> > learning curve than GitHub and so it does take a bit of effort to
>>> > learn its features.
>>> >
>>> > - Wes
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 11:05 PM, Wes McKinney <wesmckinn@xxxxxxxxx>
>>> wrote:
>>> >> Thanks all. I'm intrigued by Discourse (for some reason I keep typing
>>> >> "discourge.org"); we should inquire with ASF infra to see if they
>>> >> would be willing to support it for us. It's important that we develop
>>> >> a public record for the project, and for that data to be archived and
>>> >> indexed in some place that is owned by the ASF. I'm frankly -0 on
>>> >> having a fourth communication channel (outside of e-mail/JIRA/GitHub)
>>> >> since three is already a lot to keep track of. If we had a larger
>>> >> maintainer team, I might feel differently.
>>> >>
>>> >> Travis had some questions about GitHub and JIRA. JIRA is the only
>>> >> system of record for concrete development activity in the project. We
>>> >> use GitHub pull requests to submit patches (some projects use Gerrit,
>>> >> or attach patch files to JIRA), but all of the data generated on these
>>> >> PRs (code review comments, etc.) is mirrored back to JIRA.
>>> >> Furthermore, JIRA activity is relayed to the issues@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> >> mailing list. So ultimately we have a public record for the project on
>>> >> mailing lists.
>>> >>
>>> >> Many newcomers have never interacted with an Apache project before,
>>> >> and so when they go to http://github.com/apache/arrow their first
>>> >> reaction is to look for the Issues tab to report a bug or ask for
>>> >> something. For a long time we didn't have issues turned on, and we
>>> >> found that people were "bouncing" rather than seeking out the mailing
>>> >> list or JIRA. We'd rather capture the information somewhere rather
>>> >> than lose it. We have an issue template asking people to either use
>>> >> the mailing list or JIRA, but a lot of people ignore it unfortunately:
>>> >> https://github.com/apache/arrow/blob/master/.github/ISSUE_TEMPLATE.md.
>>> >>
>>> >> - Wes
>>> >>
>>> >> On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 10:52 PM, Kenta Murata <muraken@xxxxxxxxx>
>>> wrote:
>>> >>> Hi everyone,
>>> >>>
>>> >>> I heard from Kou that you’re discussing to stop using Slack.
>>> >>> So I want to propose another way to use Discourse.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> On 2018/06/21 18:46:54, Dhruv Madeka <m...@xxxxxxx> wrote:
>>> >>>> The issue with discourse is that you either have to host it or pay
>>> for them
>>> >>>> to host it
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Discourse provides free hosting plan for community friendly opensource
>>> projects.
>>> >>> See this article for the details:
>>> >>> <https://blog.discourse.org/2016/03/free-discourse-forum-
>>> hosting-for-community-friendly-github-projects/>
>>> >>>
>>> >>>> but still +1 for discourse, its a really nice format (I actually
>>> +1'ed the
>>> >>>> PyTorch forum on this thread too)
>>> >>>
>>> >>> I’m also +1 for discourse because I’m managing
>>> https://discourse.ruby-data.org/ by this plan.
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Regards,
>>> >>> Kenta Murata
>>>